South Africa Flag logo

South African Skeptics

March 21, 2019, 23:39:07 PM
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
Go to mobile page.
News: Please read the posting guidelines before posting.
   
   Skeptic Forum Board Index   Help Forum Rules Search GoogleTagged Login Register Chat Blogroll  
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic:

Uhuru

 (Read 145520 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Interested
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 4


« Reply #105 on: June 27, 2008, 09:46:31 AM »

Good morning Luthon64,

If needs be I will point out some of the events predicted by Siener that has been fullfilled:
- Events relating to the Anglo Boer War
- The death of De La Ray
- Events regarding the 1914 Rebelion
- The rise of President Mandela
- Power failures in SA, strikes
- Black on black violence
- The death of Princes Diana to name a few

I assume that you have read the book/s about Siener van Rensburg, it does supprise me then how you ask to name some of the fullfilled predictions as the book clearly illustrate some of these events. And yes, someone stated that predictions always get associated with an event that has happened, true... as 'predictions' pose as warnings not fact, and it is usually easier to see the relevance once an event has been fullfilled, and no this does not mean that one should try and pin predictions to every event with similarities but with total similarity. There are instances where the people who where warned by Siener had to make the choice whether or not to act on it. And in most cases he only warned people of events that might happen, they chose to act on it. Once again it comes down to your personal choice to take note of the warning and/or believe it.

The source of my information comes from googling Siener and Johanna Brandt (there is allot of crap as well), reading the books "Words of a prophet", "Bloedvlag oor Priska" and the "Krauss document". I am also in the fortunate position to be a close friend of Adam Vosloo (translated Words of a prophet to Afrikaans), who in turn is a very close friend of Adraain Snyman (the original author of Words of a prophet), both of them did there research thouroughly before publishing these documents and therefore I regard them to be some of the more reliable resources to consult.

On Siener and Brandt:
Reading pleasure and chronology support, enjoy:
1. http://www.gutenberg.org/files/20194/20194-h/20194-h.htm
2. http://www.thetruthrevealed.net/afr_johannabrandt.html - note the date 1916
3. http://www.proteaboekhuis.co.za/johanna%20brandt1.htm
4. Words of a prophet - In 1921, the Seer had a terrifying vision of a night attack Pg 160 (once again assuming that you read the book)

It seems your googling skills are not up to scratch hey? Wink

All people:
is it save to assume that you are not Christian? Once again your choice and I respect that.

You have a point there, it is a bit self-contadicting. Maybe I should have worded it differently "God alone has the final say" meaning that God does allow man to influence his own future or at least the outcome to an extent.

If you read the Bible there will be some examples of this:
1. Noah for instance, God didn't force him to build the Arc, He instructed him to do so, what would have happened if Noah decided otherwise - his choice to obey: yes God would most propably use someone else then.
2. Sodem and Gomorrah, God instructed anyone who flees not to turn around, yet one woman did and she was turned into a salt pillar, her personal choice to do so - she was warned but chose to ignore it.
3. God warns that one should not "sleep around" (cant get the English word for this) or else suffer the consequences of disease.
4. With regards to the final say of the worlds end, the whole of Revelation's is what God WILL do and there is nothing any man can do about that. Once again it is my choice to believe it and yours to disagree.

And honestly, is there any country in the world that you can point to me where different racial groups (people) life in total harmony?

Correction, God is He and not she... I do take then that you do not read the Bible, as it clearly states in the Bible "My Father in heaven".

And the warnings are not to "specially chosen individuals", as far as I remember we all have access to the same reading material and information, it is your choice at the end whether to take note of it, and/or to believe it.

Sorry bout the colours, was a bit much! But it has been kindly corrected by blueGray - thanks for that!

Enjoy the day and the weekend! On the Zim war issue... seems someone was a bit over eager, lets hope and pray all works out fine and peacefully at the end.

Regards
Interested
Logged
bluegray
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +9/-3
Offline Offline

Posts: 1107



saskeptics
WWW
« Reply #106 on: June 27, 2008, 12:36:09 PM »

There is potential to go off topic here. Please start a new thread or stick to the topic. But do continue Wink
Logged
Pooh Bear
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 1


« Reply #107 on: June 30, 2008, 04:03:58 AM »

Hello all.

Brace yourselves, its a long one.  I am referring to the blog… Wink

I like to consider myself an African.  I am white but no less an African than anyone who is black and considered an African or South African.
I love this country as much as many of you do.

I became aware of this Uhuru rhetoric about a year ago and have heard more and more about it over the past while.  Initially i discounted it as delusional rubbish yet after hearing more and more it did start to bother me hearing of my impending doom, and that of my family.
I spoke to as many people as i could from all walks of life and they too had heard of Uhuru.
The general feeling was that it is a load of rubbish, yet all were concerned to varying degrees.

Almost everyone said it could not happen over here, yet I find myself wondering how anyone can be that naïve.  Look at what happened in the DRC, Sierra Leone, Somalia and not yet on the same scale but Zimbabwe and the now demented dictator Robert Mugabe is terrifying his population with threats of murder and what I see as genocide if they vote against him.
Zimbabwe is going to the dogs; the opposition leader withdraws from the election in order to spare the lives of those who would vote for him.  How often do you hear of African leaders who would be this selfless, as history has shown many African leaders would resort to violence on a massive scale to ensure their agenda is adhered to and that they end up in the seat of power.  For this I applaud Mr. Tsvangirai.

Just like in many other African countries, those in power did not give it up without a fight, what is old Uncle Robert doing now...
“Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely”.

A few years ago many of us would not have thought it would have gone this far in Zimbabwe, yet look at it now.  Anyone still doubt it could happen here? 
Mr. Maleme of the ANC Youth Wing has said he will take up arms for Mr. Zuma.  Then last week Mr. Zwelinzima Vavi said he would kill for Mr. Zuma, what next?
Mr. Zuma himself at every opportunity sings his song, “Unshiniwam” which in English roughly translated is “give me my machine gun”.  Sure it could just be a rally to his supporters in an attempt to muster up passion for his cause and ensure more votes by appealing to their situation.

What kind of leaders are our largely ignorant vote casting masses electing to power.  I do not mean anything negative or derogatory by this, there is a huge percentage of our population who do not have an education, and even if they do have one it is of such a poor standard so as to make little difference.
Every country has its rich, poor and middle classes and those in between.  The problems we face in South Africa are the same problems most other countries face, albeit we have a nasty crime problem which our Govt is loathe to address.

I do not believe this event (Uhuru) will take place, if anything there may be sporadic unrest here and there upon the passing of the great Mr. Mandela but other than that I do not see chaos breaking out, not here and not now.  Back in 1992 or thereabouts you can see the chanting and singing of the masses where they regurgitate hate speech as the movie suidlanders shows, but that was a long time ago and things were a lot different back then.  If anything those same people chanting that rubbish are as frustrated with their govt now as they were with the previous lot, things have not gotten much better for them as grass root levels.

I became quite concerned after hearing more and more of this and stocked up on ammunition as is my right to, being a legal firearms owner and active sportsperson in the field of clay pigeon shooting and hunting.  Once done, I found myself doubting myself and what I had heard and seeing what I had done in that I bought ammunition because of what I had heard, I stopped dead in my tracks.  I was getting caught up in this war mongering and in doing so was feeding the fear that this kind of rhetoric spreads.  I then gathered up as much information as I could on this topic and came to my own conclusions.

Bollocks!  This is what I believe.  I choose to believe every other South African out there wants peace and prosperity for all other South African’s just as I do.  I treat everyone with the respect and dignity they deserve and hope that everyone else can do the same.  If we can do this we will reach Utopia, never mind Uhuru.

“Far better it is to dare mighty things,
than to forever dwell in that perpetual light,
that knows neither victory nor defeat”. ~ Theodore Roosevelt ~
The perpetual light in this case can be seen as ignorance, do not believe everything you hear, question everything, face your fears and do the right thing, whatever that may be for you.

If things do eventually go South, I will be deeply saddened and will mourn South Africa and take my family to safer pastures, God willing.

Sleep tight, i know i will tonight.
Logged
Mefiante
Defollyant Iconoclast
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +61/-9
Offline Offline

Posts: 3740


In solidarity with rwenzori: Κοπρος φανεται


WWW
« Reply #108 on: June 30, 2008, 14:24:05 PM »

Hello and welcome to the forum, Pooh Bear.  I must say, I do like your first post Smiley .

Thanks for the links and pointers, Interested.  The level of my Googling skills is not really at issue here because I wanted to know which information sources you yourself were using, something Google would have some trouble revealing.  I have barely started the Project Gutenberg Brandt book, and the van Rensburg text I have yet to locate.  I will comment on these and how they relate, if at all, to the topic of Uhuru in due course.

The Protea Boekhuis reference is to a review of a book that covers a short period of Brandt’s later life.  The review makes no mention of any prophecies, Uhuru-related or otherwise.  This observation is a little suspicious because prophecy is such a very rare and precious talent.  At the moment, this leaves the “Johanna Brandt Profesieë” for our consideration.  The description you mentioned here of an alleged Uhuru prediction by Brandt supposedly involved an angel, a miniature assegai, the Roman numeral XL and the decimation of Johannesburg’s white  people.

The first problem is the loose generality and general looseness of this so-called prophecy.  There is no mention of any timeframe or schedule in which these events are supposed to take place.  Nor are there any specifics given in respect of the numbers involved – “thousands and thousands” (“duisende en duisende”) can mean just about whatever the reader feels like: a few thousand or a few hundred thousand, a very wide range of choices.  Notice also that the name “Uhuru” doesn’t occur at all, nor does any reference appear anywhere to similar events in Kenya and elsewhere in Africa as yet-to-happen Uhuru precedents, only a biblical reference to an old testament myth “that ‘Egyptian night’” (“daardie ‘Egiptiese nag’”), where a mass slaughter allegedly took place.  Further on, the report implies that the perpetrators refer to “Our Great Day,” (that should be “Night,” surely!), and the concept of “freedom” or “emancipation,” which is implicit in “Uhuru,” gets no mention either.

More technically, I am equally intrigued that Brandt’s purported prophecy speaks quite clearly and unequivocally of “cutting off power connections in and around the city” (“hulle sny die kragverbindings binne en rondom die stad af”).  Unfortunately for Brandt, it’s no longer quite as simple and straightforward as her words indicate.  The city is subdivided into grids and networks and has several redundant backup and rerouting systems, which is a longish way of saying that it is not an easy matter to deprive the city completely and suddenly of power.

Furthermore, Brandt is clear that her prognostications of murder and mayhem in Johannesburg City are to befall only white people at the hands of black people.  The incongruity in the latter avowal is that by far the majority of present Johannesburg City residents are non-white.

Elsewhere, the article claims that “owing to the frightfulness of this vision, Johanna Brandt went completely grey in a single night,” (“Vanweë die verskrikking van hierdie gesig het Johanna Brandt ineenenkele nag heeltemal grys geword”) meaning, presumably, her hair.  While this claim can be written off as artistic licence, it has no place in a factual account because it constitutes something of a medical miracle in that no known mechanism can produce the claimed effect in such a short period.

There are also “predictions” concerning a contemporaneous “famine in Europe, but especially England in which millions will die,” whereas “Germany will be the world’s breadbasket, just like Egypt was then.”  These prognostications seem extremely far-fetched when viewed against the background of present socio-political and economic climates prevailing in those places, but if one accepts that they were voiced in 1916 and one remembers that this was about two years into World War I when it still looked like Germany was going to win, it makes much more sense.  Moreover, the Afrikaner sentiment has usually favoured Germany over Britain because of their own conflicts with the British, so there may have been a tinge of wishful colouring to Brandt’s pronouncements.

Brandt also asserts that South Africa “will be the land of the future” because “there are valuable minerals in our ground … that will place us at the forefront of developments in the world” and “certain other unknown riches in the ground.”  South Africa has never been at the forefront mentioned, notwithstanding our country’s mineral wealth, which is not to say that it might not get there at some point in the future, only that Brandt’s words seem more than a little wrongheaded here.  In fact, not too long ago, the country dropped from its long-time first position as largest gold producer in the world.

Finally, Brandt labels the Boers as “god’s chosen people” and predicts that “god’s blessings will once again rest on us.”  Many Jews will contest the “chosen people” bit and current indications are not in favour of the idea that a god is especially concerned with the fate of the Boer (or anyone else, for that matter).

All in all, then, the connection between Brandt’s alleged prediction and a supposed Uhuru event in South Africa is, by my reckoning, far too tenuous, given the numerous incongruities and vagueness pointed out above.  I think it is more likely that Brandt was deeply affected and influenced by the no doubt traumatic events of her time and worked through her fears and apprehensions in the best way she knew how – by giving them a religion-inspired quasi-mystical voice.

'Luthon64
Logged
Daan
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 1


« Reply #109 on: September 18, 2008, 08:15:40 AM »

All true comments but do we choose to ignore the evidence of things happening? Do we believe like the white farmers in Zimbabwe that there is a long future for us in our country?? Wake up friends and if you do not believe the Uhuru evidence, then at least watch the news on your own TV sets and see how a judicial system can be manipulated to suit the needs of an political party and then also recently on the SABC news it was reported on the empty military training camp found. How do you then explain this, why secret military camps if our free democratic country has one of the best equiped defence forces in the continent? Who and what is then using secret training camps? I choose to look at the facts and prepare myself accordingly. For those people that believe that those of us that do believe that this is a reality are all volkstaat supporters, you are so wrong! I firmly believe in the idea of a free and democratic South Africa and I am also of the personal opinion that the idea of a volkstaat will never work in the African continent. This said, I also believe that we as a minority group in our beautiful country cannot and must not ignore all these warning lights alarming us and we need to look at facts and evidence and be prepared. As for myself, I choose to die fighting for my family and belongings than to sit still and be stoned to death!
Daan
Logged
haasdaas
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #110 on: September 21, 2008, 23:01:50 PM »

All true comments but do we choose to ignore the evidence of things happening? Do we believe like the white farmers in Zimbabwe that there is a long future for us in our country?? Wake up friends and if you do not believe the Uhuru evidence, then at least watch the news on your own TV sets and see how a judicial system can be manipulated to suit the needs of an political party and then also recently on the SABC news it was reported on the empty military training camp found. How do you then explain this, why secret military camps if our free democratic country has one of the best equiped defence forces in the continent? Who and what is then using secret training camps? I choose to look at the facts and prepare myself accordingly. For those people that believe that those of us that do believe that this is a reality are all volkstaat supporters, you are so wrong! I firmly believe in the idea of a free and democratic South Africa and I am also of the personal opinion that the idea of a volkstaat will never work in the African continent. This said, I also believe that we as a minority group in our beautiful country cannot and must not ignore all these warning lights alarming us and we need to look at facts and evidence and be prepared. As for myself, I choose to die fighting for my family and belongings than to sit still and be stoned to death!
Daan
Logged
haasdaas
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 2


« Reply #111 on: September 21, 2008, 23:16:37 PM »

Daan

I totally agree with u on your comment.I'm not to worried about my belongings(it is replaceable)but the lives of my family is not. So i those to be prepaired, whether it happens or not (VOORSORG IN BETER AS NASORG)
Logged
Interested
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 4


« Reply #112 on: October 21, 2008, 12:44:53 PM »

Dear Luthon64,

trust that all is well and that you still follow this blog (even if it is only out of pure curiosity Smiley. I do apologize for the long break... was fun though. Kindly disregard my comment on your googling skills as I see your point. No let's get back to the real stuff.

Regarding the documents for van Rensburg and Brandt, I will gladly send you copies, electronic off-course. Else, you should be able to order them from Vaandel Uitgewers (www.vaandel.co.za).

Brandt published many books, not specific to her visions. She only had 5 visions, one of which is about a supposed night attack on Johannesburg. I never said her prediction was directly related to "Uhuru", I said "No one can say that it points to the same event but it does however raise concern that two predictions depicting an attack was made. I am not implying that it is the same but it makes me think" - see my first post. You are correct to say that it makes no mention of time-frames, neither does any of van Rensburg's predictions. They use event's as an 'indication', not a deadline of events 'to come' - (may or may not - thus a prediction) eg. strikes etc. Let's not get of track with 'numbers' as I don't think that is really the topic of discussion, whether it be 10 or 10 000, it would still be a horrible event - if it ever happens. And as mentioned... I never said it is "Uhuru", and honestly,  "Our Great Day" could mean their day of Freedom or Victory.

I'm not sure I understand your point on "Notice also that the name “Uhuru” doesn’t occur at all, nor does ...". But do have a look at 'planned campaigns' whether they were executed or not I would not know, but it is interesting to note the 'names' and 'objectives' of these campaigns and by whom they were planned:

Your Favorite Research :: View topic - 'Operation Uhuru' - Night ...The plans are variously dubbed "Operation Vula," "Night of the Long Knives," " Operation White Clean-up," "Operation Iron Eagle" and "Red October campaign." ...
www.yourfavoriteresearch.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42&sid=4af12a36681f8afd860385759d45a20e - 82k - Cached - Similar pages.

Couldn't agree more on cutting the power lines... the will need huge, nasty knives to achieve this. Let's look at this, "sny die kragverbindings af", does not necessarily mean to 'literally cut', in Afrikaans it could mean to "stop" or "disable". And yes, grids and networks are much easier to disable than cutting high voltage power lines - if you can get the right person to do what you want (who knows?). And to "deprive the city completely and suddenly of power" is not so difficult to achieve if you look at what happened to a third of the city with one lightning strike (the much needed stormy weather of last night). So technically not impossible.

On "Johannesburg City residents are non-white...", most definitely yes, but she says "she saw them enter the ‘White’ areas and murdering people everywhere, sparing nobody..." and "... that will descend on the resident of Johannesburg, she warned." - Your point being?

Regarding famine... as you so nicely put it "socio-political and economic climates prevailing...", doesn't seem so far-fetched with the current economic turmoil going round wouldn't you say, but then again it's only a prediction... not that I see the relevance to "Uhuru". I do understand where you are going with this and you are entitled to your opinion. "God's chosen people", as I understand, Brand't was very affectionate towards the Boer and the suffering they had to endure "yes people, believe it or not... all nations or cultures endure there share of suffering...", so it might have been with this in mind that she refers to the Boer as "God's chosen people".

Thanks for your response... keeps me on my toes as I try and keep an open mind and facts as straight as possible. Regarding Pooh Bears opinion of "Uhuru", I think that most South African's (black, white, Indians and all) believe as you do, I honestly hope that these predictions never come true and that all find a way of living in peace and harmony...! I would suggest to hang on to your stock pile a little longer, as it is interesting to note that Siener also said:

A)
A far-fetched prediction to make and cocky at that wouldn't you say 'Luthon64
“3) Collapse of the World Economic System — Vision: 29th September 1919: ‘An empty shop stands in Europe; people flee North in wagons filled with rubbish. Many Americans emerge from Western Europe, and when they disappear, little naked blacks from Africa run North’. A depression that will make all other disasters look like child’s play is facing the world. [See vision: 3rd August 1918.] Nothing will have hard value any longer and there will be no money. It will hit Europe so hard that England will financially go under in the process. America will intervene and try to help, and a starving black Africa, will swarm to Europe (naked little ‘black’). - One only has to keep track of the news on what's happening, and I do not mean the crap you see on SABC.

B)
“I see merino rams (cabinet) in session with their heads put together, as there are extremely urgent matters to be discussed.”
These ‘urgent’ matters must mean some great crisis for the Government of the day. This is the first vision of this kind, Van Rensburg has had: “During this time I see a much bigger strike than that of 1922 and all the trains in the Union, except the train between German West and Prieska, are at a standstill. Their crews are also on strike.”
Concurrent with the strike, Van Rensburg also saw a massive power failure in Gauteng (formerly Johannesbur-area); some people will still have firewood for cooking purposes, while others will have to eat cold food.

As far as my knowledge goes, I think that government is in for a bumpy ride not even thinking about the global economy. There are interesting developments which may point to Sieners predictions, so on Uhuru... in my opinion "Liewers bang Jan as dooie Jan". As stated before - I take note of the warnings (predictions) but my trust and hope will always be in God.

Someone has told me that certain events will take place between 2 and 20 November that will act as warning signs for such an event - (I know... I also have my doubts).

Till later then, and remember "Uhuru - Not yet... hopefully never!"

Regards
Interested
Logged
Mefiante
Defollyant Iconoclast
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +61/-9
Offline Offline

Posts: 3740


In solidarity with rwenzori: Κοπρος φανεται


WWW
« Reply #113 on: December 09, 2013, 20:19:58 PM »



Okay, so now that the essential requirement has (sadly but inevitably) been met, whut naow indeed?  Uhuru must be one of those Rapture thingies:  Always just around the corner.

'Luthon64
Logged
brianvds
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +12/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 1738



WWW
« Reply #114 on: December 10, 2013, 04:54:09 AM »

Okay, so now that the essential requirement has (sadly but inevitably) been met, whut naow indeed?  Uhuru must be one of those Rapture thingies:  Always just around the corner.

It's still going ahead. They're just waiting for the funeral, see? :-)
Logged
Tweefo
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +9/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 1514



WWW
« Reply #115 on: December 10, 2013, 09:11:50 AM »

I am also getting a lot of this crap, they also refer to it as "the night of the long (or sharp) knives".
Logged
cr1t
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +4/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 544



cr1t
« Reply #116 on: December 10, 2013, 10:31:09 AM »

I heard they robbed a restaurant the other night, and the shouted the night of the long knives is here.
Logged
brianvds
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +12/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 1738



WWW
« Reply #117 on: December 10, 2013, 11:40:15 AM »

I heard they robbed a restaurant the other night, and the shouted the night of the long knives is here.


I am less worried about the night of the long knives than about the possibility of rightwingers conducting a preemptive strike, and thus fulfilling their own prophecies...
Logged
BoogieMonster
NP complete
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +19/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 2997



« Reply #118 on: December 10, 2013, 12:43:46 PM »

Yawn

Crazy people will spout crazy shit until the day that there are no more people.
Logged
Faerie
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +10/-2
Offline Offline

Posts: 2108



« Reply #119 on: December 10, 2013, 14:42:03 PM »

I heard they robbed a restaurant the other night, and the shouted the night of the long knives is here.


I am less worried about the night of the long knives than about the possibility of rightwingers conducting a preemptive strike, and thus fulfilling their own prophecies...


I'm "blessed" with rightwing extended family.  Received a sms early Friday morning letting me know that I'm welcome at the family farm if I need to flee.  So I'm imagining the lot sitting there on the remote farm in the old Eastern Transvaal (no, NOT Mpumalanga), building moats and setting up strategic firewalls to shoot the invading natives from offering prayers for protection. Gods help us.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10   Go Up
  Print  


 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
Page created in 0.954 seconds with 23 sceptic queries.
Google visited last this page March 16, 2019, 05:50:07 AM
Privacy Policy