Gun control

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Tweefo (December 15, 2012, 06:02:03 AM):
After the terrible school shooting in America the debate (of gun control) will warm up once again. Like any issue it's got two sides but one thing I think everybody can agree on is the rate of fire. To have automatic weapons in the hands of madmen is not a good thing. Maybe you need a gun to protect yourself but if the problem is not solved after four or five shots it is not going to be solved by another 20 or 30. The guns used in this shooting was not low caliber, slow, small magazine capacity weapons. You'll never be able to stop some madman from killing but what could have been a two or three killed tragedy is now a twenty six massacre.
BoogieMonster (December 15, 2012, 22:28:05 PM):
And if he didn't have any guns at all he could always have cooked up a bomb from fertilizer and taken out the whole school.

It really doesn't matter what laws you pass, if some dude decides to take out something he'll find a way to do it: Guns or no guns.

Now a different question: Would this have ended quicker had any/more teachers been in possession of (auto or non) firearms?

Would one even attempt it if you knew you'd be gunned down after your second shot? Assuming this person did it for some kind of noteriety, I'd say no.

Edit: Moreover, we live in a country where fully-automatic weapons are NOT allowed to be owned by civilians. And as a result the old adage rings true: The only people with the AK-47's are criminals. Do you think that is a more reasonable situation than being afforded the same weaponry used by criminals to defend yourself?
Faerie (December 16, 2012, 05:31:52 AM):
In some US states you can buy a gun in the same manner as buying a pair of tekkies. No ID, no background checks, just slap the cash on the counter. Its a scary thought. Most (if not all) of the school shootings are done by under-20's with access to their parent's weapons. There should be some sort of gun control imo, although disarming the population in its entirety should not be a scenario - here its a major schlep to purchase and licence a gun and although we have the criminal aspect to content with, we have'nt had any mass school shootings (that I know of), generally our kids tend to stick scissors into each other, and scissors can only kill one at a time.

As for shooting criminals, I'm always reminded of two incidents (one fairly recently) where families were feeling threatened and actually used their guns for "protection", one shot his housekeeper's 9 year old grandson and the other his own daughter through a closed door when she came to their bedroom on hearing a disturbance. Both tragedies, both were preventable.
brianvds (December 16, 2012, 05:36:10 AM):
I think that if everybody is armed, then in such a situation very soon everybody will be shooting at everybody else, because it can be difficult to distinguish the good guys from the bad guys, and most people are not well enough trained to remain calm. On the other hand, the right to own a gun is not just a safety issue, but also one of civil liberties.

My suggestion for a compromise: anyone can own a gun, even without a license, as long as it is a muzzle loader. Then people who like shooting can still have their guns, but massacres become pretty difficult to pull off. :-)

Tweefo (December 16, 2012, 09:09:00 AM):
Quote
Posted by: BoogieMonster
And if he didn't have any guns at all he could always have cooked up a bomb from fertilizer and taken out the whole school.

It really doesn't matter what laws you pass, if some dude decides to take out something he'll find a way to do it: Guns or no guns.

Where do you draw the line? Are we going to sell nukes at the corner shop in the end? To do something quickly, people usually use the tools available. This guy could have got himself some belt-feed Arnold Schwarzenegger type gun, and really do some damage, but he did not. I think this was a spur of the moment thing, and if he could only get hold of, say a 6 shot revolver, he would have used that.
Just a bottom up approach to control would not work. You are also going to need a top down effort. You need to control whats available.
Regarding the AK's here in SA: The genie is out the bottle and these things are on the street. That is a problem, but to just come up with something bigger, faster or maybe thicker body amour is a silly exercise. The other side would just evolve something better. I think the biggest problem is the uncontrolled manufacturing of weapons and since this happen world wide it is going to need a world wide solution.

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