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The side effects of Women's Lib

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BoogieMonster
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« on: May 11, 2015, 17:46:09 PM »

This is just a brain dump of an un-finished exploration I'm doing at the moment....

So, a topic I've been absorbing a lot about recently... which I hadn't realised had evolved into such a massive battle of the sexes in the western world.

It all started when I started following news and current events about GamerGate and Anita Sarkeesian. I investigated and found IMHO that:

(a) Anita had made fairly ridiculous claims (Lies) about video games and basically (in a moral sense) defrauded a lot of people of a lot of money. In the name of Feminism. Then got a free pass from the Feminist movement but...

(b) Men/Male Children had taken their response to her bullshit to ridiculous levels, some would say dangerous levels.

So, now you have 2 wrongs. However it starts to dawn on you how strongly young people feel about the subject these days. But my readings started leading me in somewhat different directions...

Soon it became clear that the modern feminist movement, as some of you probably already know, is a fairly amorphous blob of varying levels of reasonableness and/or extremism. With subsections of it (once again IMHO) closely resembling a religion. (Ex: Giving members a free pass on unacceptable behaviour because they're "one of us", demanding special privileges, professional victims even in positions of power, etc..).

Then I start hearing the following claim over, and over, and over: "Well, if you believe in equality, you're a feminist". Hey, even Hermoine from Harry Potter said it right?

Then the resounding response comes, surprisingly from females as well as males:
"No, I'm a humanist, there's no need to be that specific, if you need to be that specific you are asking for special treatment."

Which, in my current view of how things have shaken out, is exactly true. Females today enjoy special privileges over men in many aspects yet a certain number still feel oppressed by "the patriarchy". Which in turn reads a whole lot like a conspiracy theory of epic proportions. (Note I'm talking about THE USA here, not Iraq).

So, you may be yawning at this point going "ho hum, heard it all before".

BUT, this is where it gets interesting. It appears a growing number of young(er than me) men in the west have decided having a wife or female partner of any kind has become way too risky (According to THEM): Courts favour females in divorce proceedings and this bankrupts men who did nothing wrong other than be "the wrong guy", Females abuse male partners and cops don't care, should the male defend himself he's sure to end up in jail. Females get preferential employment, can cry rape/sexual harassment/emotional abuse at any moment with nary recourse for the man subject to such allegations. Females (in the USA) win the vast majority of custody battles, moreover child support allocations, moreover alimony. SO, these guys reckon... Screw it: I'll be MGTOW. And it seems that way of thinking is catching on... As if there aren't ANY females out there with good intentions, good morals, ambition, drive, intelligence, etc...  I guess that's the kind of view these kids grew up with of the world, perhaps their distaste amplified by the broader media's portrayal of dads as stupid sports-worshopping drooling buffoons who need to be "handled" by a good smart woman (EDIT: And double as walking ATM's).

I find all this enormously interesting... like nature is fighting back to restore the balance kind of thing. You have to look at the current state of affairs and in a way marvel that you never anticipated that such a thing would happen.

And once again I see the great universal constant: Every liberation movement tends to be a complete over-reaction: One way or the other, the reaction always seems to be extreme.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2015, 17:58:31 PM by BoogieMonster » Logged
brianvds
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« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2015, 03:28:58 AM »

Similarly, it is nowadays increasingly risky to:

1. Work with children, due to the danger of having one's life destroyed through accusations of sexual abuse; and
2. employ anyone, seeing as it is well-nigh impossible to get rid of them if they don't do their job; and
3. rent out property, because it is all but impossible to evict non-paying renters.

Etc. etc. We seem to live ever more isolated, solitary lives, where it is easier and more convenient to work with machines rather than people.

PS: According to dictionary.com, "well-nigh" as used above (and similarly, "almost") is an adverb. Is "impossible" a verb then? :-)
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Faerie
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« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2015, 10:13:02 AM »

Its something thats been p*ssing me off for a couple years now.  Equality - yes, same pay for same job - yes, but this bleating that you are patronising when you (man) hold the door for me and rude if you dont, well, that is just bullshit. Equality means holding the door for him too, its just polite.

I've caused ruckus every year for the last five about the "bring the girl child to work" thing, and encouraged those areas I'm able to influence to bring the boys too.

I dont blame the young men/boys for reacting in this manner, have you taken note of the generation of young females lately? My head spins after some of my sessions, the sense of entitlement is gobsmacking. The boys seem to still understand that they need to work for life to progress and their questions are in that line as well, the girls though, hell, they expect to be promosted and patted on the back because they answered the phone and if you correct them they get all pouty and proclaim that you dont like her.

All a load of nonsense in my opinion.  Equality is what feminism started out as, but you always have a couple idiots wat die hol onder die hoender uitruk.
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st0nes
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« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2015, 10:17:32 AM »

I've caused ruckus every year for the last five about the "bring the girl child to work" thing, and encouraged those areas I'm able to influence to bring the boys too.
Since I have neither a girl nor a boy child I asked if I could bring my dog instead.  They said no.  Speciesist barstards.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2015, 11:18:04 AM »

I dont blame the young men/boys for reacting in this manner, have you taken note of the generation of young females lately?

No, this is news to me. The list of sites/articles/videos by these men describing modern women as sociopathic slavedrivers was surprising to me. The idea seems to be that these young women, now over-empowered, believe what they deserve is for men to work so they don't have to. The women they describe believe men exist to feed their spending appetites, and men will happily submit to this for the mere price of sex. They demand access to the boardroom, but not the boiler-room, etc. I have to admit... At times it's even got me kinda spooked for the sake of these young guns. If there's truth to it, as you seem to indicate, it's worrying.
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Faerie
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« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2015, 13:57:20 PM »

There are some really worrying trends.  Couple months ago we had an incident in the parking lot caught on camera.  Young chap (23/24 therabouts) worked late (around 8pm) and was just leaving, as he exited the building, a woman (now his ex girlfriend) flung herself onto the car and started pounding on the windscreen and jumping up and down on the bonnet whilst screaming at him that he's a cheat.  Security removed her - this is all on camera and makes for some interesting viewing.  I saw him the next day and apparently she's "just really insecure and a little bit jealous", he was initially attracted to her because she was pretty. He fortunately came to his senses and dumped her (had to get a protection order).

I showed the video to some of my ladies' groups, they all in their 20's - 35's age group, and the amount of support the bonnet jumper got was scary, even after the group were told that the chap in question is completely innocent of the accusation, they still supported the woman because "the guy must have done something wrong". 

How one goes about changing this type of attitude I have no idea, but I fear for my sons and the next generation - can you imagine the lost kids these women are going to raise?

I'm hoping my boys will be fortunate (and intelligent) enough to find a down to earth girl with brains that she can actually use.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2015, 15:11:07 PM »

"the guy must have done something wrong". 

I've decided to henceforth reply to such lunacy with: "I hope you like cats".
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Faerie
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« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2015, 13:29:11 PM »

So its statments such as these that really p*sses me off:

Quote
Pardon my logical reasoning, but in a society in which men are greatly overvalued at the expense of women, surely we have to devalue men at least somewhat in order to level the playing field?



Nothing logical in that reasoning imo.


The rest of the article is enjoyable though:

http://www.itweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=143124&catid=79&Itemid=2354
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2015, 14:06:31 PM »

So its statments such as these that really p*sses me off:

Quote
Pardon my logical reasoning, but in a society in which men are greatly overvalued at the expense of women, surely we have to devalue men at least somewhat in order to level the playing field?


Nothing logical in that reasoning imo.

Sounds like ANC reasoning: Equality through universal destruction.

Quote
Most importantly, women should never be guilted for "devaluing" men in moving forward to take hold of the equality they deserve.

Do people actually think they sound smart when spewing faeces like this? jesus christ.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2015, 13:13:45 PM »

Just leaving this here, make your own judgements.
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st0nes
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« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2015, 14:21:08 PM »


What a coincidence! I'm listening to Mark Kermode's review of this film at this very minute.  "Watching this film is like being run over whilst being shouted at."  I think I'll give it a miss...
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Majin
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« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2015, 17:13:10 PM »

The general view in society seems that you are entitled to deserve credit, where it is not always due. Expect equal pay regardless of the quality of work.
Expect more money from the rich to go to the poor. Imo it starts in religion - with the believe that people should give to the less fortunate regardless if they are deserving. The idea then grows that you do not need to work hard. Is it surprising then: that it would not also be seen as acceptable behaviour to have/take the money that the man slaves for then.

That is part of the problem, but also try and compensate for one previously disadvantaged group it turns quite easily the other way around.

I must add though (not sure if its just where I live) but it's not regarded as proper if a women doesn't work these days, regardless that you take care of your man. Your a women so your suppose to take advantage of the rights that you were given. Somewhere along the way the message got warped. It was suppose to be about the freedom to choose.


 

     
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cr1t
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« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2015, 08:54:55 AM »

The general view in society seems that you are entitled to deserve credit, where it is not always due. Expect equal pay regardless of the quality of work.
Expect more money from the rich to go to the poor. Imo it starts in religion - with the believe that people should give to the less fortunate regardless if they are deserving. The idea then grows that you do not need to work hard. Is it surprising then: that it would not also be seen as acceptable behaviour to have/take the money that the man slaves for then.


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st0nes
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« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2015, 09:44:36 AM »

Quote from: Damon Runyon
Naturally a doll who is willing to listen instead of wishing to gab herself is bound to be popular because if there is anything most citizens hate and despise it is a gabby doll.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2015, 10:00:46 AM »

I see hard work in that picture, but not much enterprise. Even an ox can work hard, but will not achieve much without a guiding hand. Hard work is a part of success but nobody ever said it guarantees loads of money. It doesn't even work like that in the richest of 1st world countries for the most privileged of white men... you can pay a youth into Oxford but the grades won't come by themselves. But all that is besides the point anyway, the point isn't how hard (a) works or doesn't work to attain something. The question is how entitled (b) is to help themselves to things attained by (a). Whether that attainment was via expertise, hard work, intelligence, guile, or any other attribute on the part of (a).

Besides, is feeding your family not success? Those women aren't working for money they're working for sustenance, and presumably achieving that goal.

Finally I don't see how socio-economic conditions of the poorest countries in the world affects how entitled western women living in relative luxury should feel. It's not like the men in those same countries have mountains of opportunity to be investment bankers either. Their fate is not sealed because they are women, everyone around them suffers also and the solution to that won't be found by focussing on their woman-ness.

Sorry cr1t, I see your image like I saw the jabs of my mother: "Eat your food, there are starving children in Africa"... which just ends up making western kids with plenty of food overweight.

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