South Africa Flag logo

South African Skeptics

May 22, 2019, 15:51:02 PM
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
Go to mobile page.
News: Please read the posting guidelines before posting.
   
   Skeptic Forum Board Index   Help Forum Rules Search GoogleTagged Login Register Chat Blogroll  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic:

"Challenge" to skeptics

 (Read 3814 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
mdg
Sr. Member
****

Skeptical ability: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 337



WWW
« on: February 11, 2011, 15:18:17 PM »

I'm sure many of you are familiar with the 10:23 Challenge. (click on the link if you aren't)

Well here is a "challenge" from  naturopath Mike Adams, who is possibly the stupidest person on the planet. Be warned, you will have a headache after reading his incredibly confusing attempt at logic.


A quote from his post.......

Quote
I am hereby challenging the skeptics to a public drink-a-thon, each drinking the medicines we advocate. I'll meet them in a public place, and we'll each drink the medicines we believe in the most.

I'll bring a gallon of homeopathic remedies and healing raw juices, and the medical fundamentalists and their supporters (the more, the merrier) can each bring a gallon of the liquid forms of chemotherapy, blood pressure medications, coumadin, or statin drugs. We'll chug them in public and see who's left standing. The results get posted on YouTube for the whole world to see. We'll title the video, "SKEPTICS COMMIT MASS SUICIDE BY DRINKING PHARMACEUTICALS AS IF THEY WERE KOOL-AID." Jonestown, anyone?

Do you have any doubt which of us will be left standing? Sure, I may need to pee a whole lot, but the restrooms won't be crowded, because all the skeptics won't be needing them anymore.

That outcome, my friends, would be sad, but newsworthy. More importantly, it would prove an important point: Medicine should be safe for people to consume, not so deadly that you drop dead after consuming it, which is what often happens with pharmaceuticals.

But, alas, my challenge will certainly never be accepted. None of the magicians, skeptics of medical fundamentalists will be publicly chugging chemotherapy any time soon, nor any other large doses of liquid pharmaceuticals. Why? Because they know how toxic those chemicals are.

Do you notice the irony here? The only medicines they're willing to consume in large doses in public are homeopathic remedies! They won't dare consume large quantities of the medicines they all say YOU should be taking! (The pharma drugs.)

And therein rests the truth in all this: Even the skeptics know that homeopathy is inherently safer than their own medicines.

No wonder they keep attacking it: If people found out about safe medicine, where would all of Big Pharma's repeat business come from? After all, the best thing about chemotherapy (from Big Pharma's point of view) is that it creates repeat business from liver damage, kidney damage and brain damage.

All these pharmaceutical poisons are so damaging to the human body -- and brain -- that these is probably one of the main reasons why the skeptics who take all these drugs are incapable of understanding high-vibration advanced medicine. A vaccine shot every year does wonders for lowering the IQ and killing off the creative thinking portions of the brain, after all.

So if you're looking for safe medicine, definitely take a look at homeopathic remedies. They so safe that even the critics can't overdose on them... but you have to admit the attempt makes for great entertainment.



Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/031297_homeopathy_overdose.html#ixzz1Dej5eC1N
Logged
Brian
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +8/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 1367


I think therefor I am, I think


« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2011, 15:58:03 PM »

Is there a similarity in the degree/extent of delusion concerning religion and the effectiveness of homeopathic 'medicines'? I ask this due to the striking similarity in argumentation, lack of reasoning skills, honesty, plain common sense and analytical skill between those who punt religion(s) and homeopathy. In addition, criticism and a search for scientific 'tests', verification, peer reviews etc are frowned upon by both groups and information is consciously twisted to suit each groups' particular agendas.

A major difference of course is that religion is a much bigger business than homeopathy and has certainly led to many more deaths and conflict. Added to that, religion is socially probably more culturally acceptable than homeopathy although traditional woo-woo medicines are big in third world countries as well.

Now: from a socio-psychological perspective: why are people so gullible as to so readily believe in medicines that don't work (include here pseudo-science stuff, magnetic arm bands, astrology, numerology, pyramidology etc etc ad nauseam)as well as mystical nonsense such as gods, angels, magic etc etc and when confronted with systematic, scientific evidence, reject it? Is it due to some ancient meme or genetic disposition to reach for 'magic' solutions (an easy way out) and hence an almost automatic hard-wired response not to face reality? Or is it due to the remnants of evolutionary 'throwbacks' to resort to what Julian Jaynes' termed: man's 'bicameral' mind, i.e.
Quote
the bicameral mentality lures people into searching for 'sure-thing' guidance from 'higher authorities', rather than using their own consciousness for making decisions and determining their actions.
Jaynes, J: "The origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind". Houghton Mifflin Co
Logged
bluegray
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +9/-3
Offline Offline

Posts: 1107



saskeptics
WWW
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2011, 16:11:14 PM »

Nice spin Roll Eyes
I almost admire his ability to bullshit. I get his logic even, twisted as it may be.
That is why people still believe in homeopathy, because bullshit can easily sound logical, and Mike Adams seems to understand this very well.
Logged
Mefiante
Defollyant Iconoclast
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +61/-9
Offline Offline

Posts: 3743


In solidarity with rwenzori: Κοπρος φανεται


WWW
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2011, 20:20:41 PM »

All these pharmaceutical poisons are so damaging to the human body -- and brain -- that these is probably one of the main reasons why the skeptics who take all these drugs are incapable of understanding high-vibration advanced medicine. A vaccine shot every year does wonders for lowering the IQ and killing off the creative thinking portions of the brain, after all.
It seems then that our intrepid “Health Ranger” Roll Eyes got much more than his fair share of susceptibility to these “pharmaceutical poisons” and vaccines in his youth, which early damage has since been severely compounded by “high-vibration advanced” shaking of his cruelly stunted cerebrum.  It’s too much to hope that he’ll understand a similar but safer paint-your-house counterchallenge where sceptics get buckets of paint and he gets buckets of water – diluted, should he so wish.

The saddest part about this mess is that there are other people so ill-informed that they look up to an inveterate moron of Adams’ imposingly singular calibre.  On his own, he wouldn’t qualify for a tangential reference in a tabloid cartoon – even at 30X magnification.

Reading sh*t like this, can anyone blame you for despairing at thoughts of humanity’s future?  Is the problem much bigger than we thought?

'Luthon64
« Last Edit: February 11, 2011, 20:37:52 PM by Mefiante » Logged
Hermes
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +18/-2
Offline Offline

Posts: 1137



« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2011, 17:24:28 PM »

Quote
Why I'm challenging skeptics to drink a gallon of chemotherapy

Among the pages of twaddle Adams commits, the only statement that contains certain truth is that "homeopathy is not a drug". Well, neither is chemotherapy.  It's a therapy in which various drugs may be administered in accordance with a specific regimen with the express purpose of killing micro-organisms or cancerous cells.  That most chemotherapeutic drugs are administered intravenously also passes Adams by.  Are these drugs toxic?  Certainly, yes - they are intended to kill, they have severe side-effects, and an overdose could be lethal.  But they can potentially cure certain ailments, in particular cancer.  And yes, homeopathic substances are not as toxic - they simply do nothing.

I am amused by Mike Adams styling himself as the "Health Ranger".  It evokes visions of a man on a horse, armed with delusive homeopathic dilutions, riding off into to sunset.  When you're in Texas look behind you, that's where Mike Adams's gonna be.

« Last Edit: February 12, 2011, 19:06:46 PM by Hermes » Logged
ingwe
Full Member
***

Skeptical ability: +2/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 198



« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2011, 18:27:50 PM »

It would be interesting to see if Mike Adams would use chemotherapy if he or a member of his family were to need treatment for cancer!
Logged
Mefiante
Defollyant Iconoclast
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +61/-9
Offline Offline

Posts: 3743


In solidarity with rwenzori: Κοπρος φανεται


WWW
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2011, 23:00:06 PM »

News that, despite some legitimate reservations, is slightly upbeat:
CAPE TOWN — Retail pharmacy chains and SA’s biggest food store, Pick n Pay, are tightening up their agreements with suppliers of complementary medicines in expectation of the Consumer Protection Act, due to come into effect on March 31.

The act includes provisions that hold all the players in the supply chain responsible for the safety and efficacy of the goods purchased by consumers. It is expected to introduce a degree of control over the largely unregulated complementary medicine industry, with buyers given a new avenue to seek redress if they buy products that are harmful or ineffective. Complementary medicines include vitamins, supplements, homoepathic [sic], herbal and traditional remedies.
This may be a new beginning for resisting CAM’s onslaught.  If the efficacy of an alleged treatment falls within the purview of the Consumer Protection Act, it means that one could sue suppliers for misrepresenting efficacy.  However, there will be a few years’ delay while this is tested in the courts.

'Luthon64
Logged
AntiOxidant
Newbie
*

Skeptical ability: +1/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 8


The AntiOxidant - Eliminating the Free Radicals


« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2011, 09:02:54 AM »

Yes, big pharma's medicines would still dominate the market because many of them are evidence-based medicines. This means they have undergone rigorous testing to prove that their stated claims are truthful and not misleading. Admittedly, there are many of what are termed 'old medicines' which have not been subjected to modern medicine regulatory requirements to demonstrate safety, quality and efficacy.

These are so-called 'Grandfathered Medicines' which were registered decades ago (In the early 1960's) when registers for certain classes and schedules of medicines were originally opened. Medicine Regulatory authorities around the world are now beginning to re-evaluate these 'old medicines' due to them costing a fortune to government health budgets, but somehow homoeopathy escapes scrutiny.

Having said all of this, in South Africa, ALL homoeopathic medicines were registered in terms of a call-up notice by the Medicines Control Council in the early 80's after homoeopathic lobbyists, with the assistance of a sympathetic parliamentarian of the time (brother of a homoeopath) lobbied cabinet to recognise their mumbo jumbo as legit.

This coincided with the Establishment of the Allied Health Profession Board (now the Allied Health Professions Council), who begun registering homoeopaths as doctors, despite many of them having only studied two-three week correspondence courses at unapproved colleges. Many of them are still playing doctor out there today!

At no point in South African medicines regulatory history have homoeopathic meds been evaluated for their safety, quality or efficacy. The dominant homoeopathic company during the first call-up (Natura), provided a list of homoeopathic meds found in the homoeopathic bible, called the Materia Medica. This list was then accepted by the Medicines Control Council as an authoritative medicines formulary, despite no further enquiry as to whether the meds were safe to use, of good quality devoid of contaminants, and could alleviate or treat any single health condition.

After this was accomplished, all homoeopathic meds received registration numbers. At face value, the public, many doctors and pharmacists continue to believe that if a homoeopathic product has a 'U - registration number' on it's label or advert it must be safe and effective to use. They believe the government (MCC) has undertaken it's mandate to protect the public and have given the product a green light because it's a 'Registered'. This can not be further from the truth!

This pseudo-registration of homoeopathic medicine continues up to this day, and unchallenged. Currently the Health Products Association of South Africa (dominated by pseudo-health companies) are pushing the Department of Health to publish their proposed 'Complimentary Medicine Regulations' for health products and attempting to fool the regulators and public to once again. They are wanting to create the impression that homoeopathic meds are safe, are of good quality and do what they claim to do on labels, by wanting to grandfather them once again, and to allow books like the Materia Medica to be used as authoritative works on the 'science' supporting homoeopathy.

Whether homoeopathic companies which have been ripping us off for decades under the illusion that their products are properly regulated under pseudo-registration will prevail once the Consumer Protection Act comes into effect, only time will tell.

I'm in the process of finalising my official complaint, based on science against homoeopathy's biggest selling placebo product and flagship sales-leader, namely 'Rescue Remedy'. This time I'll use the incumbent Consumer Protection Act on the 1st of April, and go straight for the jugular of the homoeopathic industry. The MCC have failed us in the past. Once that product falls, the rest will follow like dominoes.

I just wish that Mike Adams lived in SA. I'd take up his challenge. Seems he did not state the ratio of fruit juice vs. homeopathic meds he will swallow by the gallon, I'd go along if he swallowed half a gallon of low potency snake poison, cancer causing agents or one of the many deadly poisons listed in the homoeopathic Materia Medica. What I mean by low potency, I'm referring to the lowest dilutions of established homoeopathy. eg 2C - 5C. He will surely DIE a horrible death because many of the original ingredients will still be present.

The biggest lie that homoeopathic companies and advocates tell people is that homoeopathy is 100% safe.
Prescribing homoeopathic medicines when a patient has acute illness or serious non-self-limiting disease will prolong the patient's need for scientific, evidence-based medicines and lead to their possible death because of false hope and iatrogenic risk.

Treatment with ineffective therapy, often results in the unnecessary progression of disease and adverse effects, and this is where homoeopathy borders on criminal.

SUMMARY

Homoeopathy is NOT safe!
Homoeopathy can NOT be measured for quality because there is NOTHING to measure.
Homoeopathy is NO more effective than Placebo! That is a FACT!

Homoeopathy fails every single criteria to be registered as a 'medicine', so why should we sponsor state-sanctioned health fraud?

Homoeopathic medicines should all be de-registered and homoeopathic product manufacturers should not be allowed to have any claims associated with their products. In fact, mandatory health warnings should be printed prominently on all products and marketing materials for homoeopathic products, stating that none have have been scientifically assessed and do not demonstrate any health benefits.

The professional register for Homoeopaths should be closed as these quacks treat nothing and prescribe nothing (It's health fraud).

The board of Health Insurance Funders must stop medical aid benefits for homoeopaths and homoeopathic medicines.

The AntiOxidant is here!
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 11:25:20 AM by AntiOxidant » Logged
cyghost
Skeptically yours
Hero Member
*****

Skeptical ability: +12/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 1409


Carpe diem


« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2011, 09:22:23 AM »

The AntiOxidant is here!
And most welcome you are!

Very Nice Post   Cheesy
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  


 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
Page created in 0.633 seconds with 23 sceptic queries.
Google visited last this page February 26, 2019, 10:46:20 AM
Privacy Policy