Puncturing the Acupuncture Myth

[st0nes]

physio's

physios please

[Hades]

I know of a guy who died of acupuncture, he was warned not to run with scissors in hand...

[Cdated]

Our neighbour is an Asian who has his own acupuncture practice, and is he one busy boy!! Something must work, the Caucasian folks love him.

[GCG]

the only needle that will come within a mile radius of me, is a tattoo needle.  the rest i will fight like a tiger.
i dont give a flying doo-dah if its good for me.
an ex friend of mine, would go to her therapist religiously.  she even had a needle stuck in her ear, and left there, to gether to stop smoking. 
as i understand, it supposedly works along your energy lines and whatnot.  which i guess can be plausible.  surely your nerves do meet up at some point and travel together towards your spine.  if sticking need into them will make any difference, i wont bet money on.
wonder how much of a placebo effect there is involved?

[Cdated]

Perhaps I should go along and be a guinea pig, I'm curious to see why it is so popular. I have more than my fair share of skepticism and cynicism so I may well just be impartial enough to deliver a moderated review.

Heck I'm just curious!!! I'll keep you updated.

[Mandarb]

If you want to do good with a needle, go to the blood bank, at least there you can see that the needle does someting, and you have a reasonable guarantee that it will go to someone who needs it.

[Andysor]

as i understand, it supposedly works along your energy lines and whatnot.  which i guess can be plausible.  surely your nerves do meet up at some point and travel together towards your spine.  if sticking need into them will make any difference, i wont bet money on.
wonder how much of a placebo effect there is involved?

A quote from a fun little fact paper by Harriet Hall M.D.:

"There were originally 360 acupuncture points (based on the number of
days of the year rather than on anatomy). Currently more than 2000
acupuncture points have been ‘discovered,’ leading one wag to com-
ment that there was no skin left that was not an acupuncture point.
There were either 9, 10, or 11 meridians—take your pick. Any number
is as good as another, because no research has ever been able to docu-
ment the existence of acupuncture points or meridians or chi. Acupunc-
ture has been shown to ‘work’ to relieve pain, nausea, and other subjective
symptoms, but it has never been shown to alter the natural history or course
of any disease. Studies have shown that acupuncture releases natural opioid pain
relievers in the brain: endorphins. Veterinarians have pointed out that loading a horse into a trailer or throw-
ing a stick for a dog also releases endorphins. Probably hitting yourself on the thumb with a hammer would
release endorphins too, and it would take your mind off your headache."

[BoogieMonster]

My favourite endorphin high is from really hot, spicy food. Yum....

(Yes I can actually discern a very slight "high" from eating really hot stuff)

[GCG]

i get a high from getting tattoed.  hurts like a bitch, but you feel like great afterwards.

[Brian]

i get a high from getting tattoed.  hurts like a bitch, but you feel like great afterwards.

U a masochist? ouch! 

[Lurkie]

Interesting discussion.

Some time ago I read a really brilliant book called "Trick or Treatment" written by the world's first prof of complementary medicine, Edzard Ernst and a physicist/science writer, Simon Singh.

Ernst is based at the Univ of Exeter in the UK and is trained as an MD and used to practice homeopathy. His most important contribution has been an ongoing quest to scientifically investigate the various flavours of complementary medicine. He seems to be one of those rare birds who can change his mind after following the evidence (in this case, the results of double-blind placebo controlled trials).

Ernst and Singh review all the published evidence for alternative medicine, and their conclusions are strongly worded:

While there is tentative evidence that acupuncture might be effective for some forms of pain relief and nausea, it fails to deliver any medical benefit in any other situations and its underlying concepts are meaningless. With respect to homeopathy, the evidence points towards a bogus industry that offers patients nothing more than a fantasy. Chiropractors, on the other hand, might compete with physiotherapists in terms of treating some back problems, but all their other claims are beyond belief and can carry a range of significant risks. Herbal medicine undoubtedly offers some interesting remedies, but they are significantly outnumbered by the unproven, disproven and downright dangerous herbal medicines on the market.

These guys take no prisoners! Singh was sued for libel by the British Chiropractic Association. The case has since been dropped.

[GCG]

i get a high from getting tattoed.  hurts like a bitch, but you feel like great afterwards.

U a masochist? ouch! 

naw...  not that bad.  at least i dont go compete in triathlons or run the comrades.  THAT'S masochistic.
tattoos are painfull in three stages.  the actuall tattoo-ing where the needle punctures your skin to insert the ink.  then afterwards, when it's kinda burny kinda tight.  then when the scabs come off, its itchy as hell, but you cant scratch.
all worth it though.

[Splat]

Acupuncture is a real science

In order to be licenced and legally practice acupuncture in South Africa, you need a 5 year BSC degree obtained from the university of the Western cape.

Anyone that does not have this degree or a acreedited diploma obtain in another country may not legaly practice acupuncture.
There are a lot offakes out there.

I dont think the University of the Western Cape would present a 5 year BSC degree if acupuncture was a myth.

PS Acupuncture has been very helpful in the traetment of ailments found in pets (which blows the pseudo effect idea out of the water)

Acupuncture can be very effective for a vast array of ailments.

[Rigil Kent]

Acupuncture has been very helpful in the traetment of ailments found in pets

I remember watching an episode of The Dog Whisperer during which a dog was treated to a session, but I cannot recall if it yelped at all.

Why do you feel that acupuncture is a science?

Mintaka

[BoogieMonster]

In order to be licenced and legally practice acupuncture in South Africa, you need a 5 year BSC degree obtained from the university of the Western cape.

You could of course also do a degree in Homeopathy....

http://www.uj.ac.za/EN/CoursesProgrammes/Courses/Pages/HomeopathyDegree.aspx

Or Chiropracty....

I've even heard some places offer degrees for Sangoma's!

Or if that isn't your thing, just go do a Masters in Theology.

These are a few of the things you can get degreed in, and I still think they're baloney. Therefore, "You can study it" doesn't make it true.