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Skepchic vs Dawkins

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Brian
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« on: July 13, 2011, 11:22:35 AM »

Massive debate and hot air flowing around Rebecca Watson alias skepchic who was propositioned in an elevator (or lift to you Sefricans), and commented that this was untoward and uncalled for: She akshuelly said:
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Um, just a word to wise here, guys, uh, don't do that. You know, I don't really know how else to explain how this makes me incredibly uncomfortable, but I'll just sort of lay it out that I was a single woman, you know, in a foreign country, at 4:00 am, in a hotel elevator, with you, just you, and—don't invite me back to your hotel room right after I finish talking about how it creeps me out and makes me uncomfortable when men sexualize me in that manner.


check it out on Pharyngula http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/07/oh_no_not_againonce_more_unto.php

In my view Dawkins should be spelled Dorkins now for trivialising the matter and indeed trying to relegate it to the unimportant?  WTF!!

and as Myers says on adding insult to injury:
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One other matter: some people muddled the issue by also pretending to be Richard Dawkins. Impersonating anyone else on this blog is an immediately bannable offense: I don't warn you, I just delete all of your comments, and then I ban both your username and your IP address. You're gone, burned to the ground. I've eradicated two Dawkins impersonators in that way. Don't do it!


The lengths people go to to cause shit!
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benguela
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« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2011, 11:42:02 AM »

recommended reading:

http://www.copypastecode.com/74204/?view=box

http://bit.ly/mPp7lg

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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2011, 12:48:33 PM »

I am now thoroughly confused thanks.... I mean with the "one paragraph" being thrown out there as to "how bad" the situation was, without much more than that... it's hard to tell exactly how persistent/creepy/untoward this guy was.

Bbbuuut I once was a single dude alone in a foreign country, on a dark street (at night) in central Africa being propositioned by a prostitute, with the pimp close by looking on ... not very friendly-like... and getting the hell out of there just going "phew, close one". I can't imagine her situation being MUCH worse.

I'd say yes it definitely makes one uber-uncomfortable looking for the exit strategy, etc. And if it happened to me every day, I wouldn't be a happy puppy. But I dunno why this is such a "atheist community uproar". Lots of men are gentlemen and take no for no. Lots of men aren't, atheist or otherwise, they're assholes. And this is where I struggle because getting a better assesment of the situation would help a ton, but it seems to be vaguely defined at the best of times. I DO think having ONE dude do this to you, and then semi-chastising a hall full of people about it is a tiny generalisation, and a bit arb.
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GCG
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« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2011, 12:54:07 PM »

i generally enjoy the persistent creep-type bloke.  they are such easy targets for my thinly veiled hate of society in general, that i enjoy pulling the sod to threads, and watch him squirm while his buddies laugh at him.. it's bliss.
if all else fails, ask him if his mother/boyfriend knows where he is.  whichever seems more applicable.  taking on a bloke's mommy issues and/or sexuality, works like a charm.
then again, the persistent creep types are usually not the brightest, so it's not as much fun as debating with intelligent individuals around a pub table  Grin
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Brian
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« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2011, 15:44:54 PM »

I should've included skepchic's rant (including 1300 responses!) against Dawkins as well. you can read it @ http://skepchick.org/2011/07/the-privilege-delusion/
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themyst1971
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« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2011, 20:43:27 PM »

I have never bought any of Dawkins skeptic themed books but I did by two of his evolutionary books and enjoyed reading them.

I have and will continue to follow Rebecca on twitter and YouTube.

As a skeptic and lover of science I find both of interest and both of them have taught me interesting lessons in the past and I expect both to do so in the future.

And as a skeptic I shall take what both say under advisement as I do when I read anything anyone posts.
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Faerie
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« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2011, 07:26:30 AM »

Sheesh, what a brou-haa, since when are sceptics and/or atheists immune to being creeps and idiots? We're still just human, and damn, dearie, as uncomfortable as it is when these things happen (being female myself and having experienced it), there are really better ways dealing with these scenarios than running to the world bleating how fulnerable you are.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2011, 10:23:39 AM »

I should've included skepchic's rant (including 1300 responses!) against Dawkins as well. you can read it @ http://skepchick.org/2011/07/the-privilege-delusion/


I wasn't saying you are vague, all the articles I clicked on in the chain ended up being vague, s'all.
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ingwe
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« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2011, 11:59:36 AM »

Sheesh, what a brou-haa, since when are sceptics and/or atheists immune to being creeps and idiots? We're still just human, and damn, dearie, as uncomfortable as it is when these things happen (being female myself and having experienced it), there are really better ways dealing with these scenarios than running to the world bleating how fulnerable you are.
And it would have been a nonevent if those few fragile male egos had not been bruised. The issue blew up out of proportion when some of those who could not accept that others use different thought processes to them started to fuss on it. Those who reacted should look at how closely their knee-jerk is to that of the religious when they complain about being persecuted!
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Brian
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« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2011, 12:30:22 PM »

My take on it is similar to BM's...one doesn't have enough information, e.g. was the elevator guy intoxicated? did skepchic greet him in any way...(why I say this is my youngest daughter who is very friendly, chatted to a London Cabby a few years ago when he took her to her flat...he then came on to her BIG time and she had major problems getting the fucker to back off!) Some egoistic pricks don't need much encouragement to try their luck.

On the other hand, the manner in which chicks respond or cry rape (which skepchick didn't) can blow the whole thing out of proportion. The IMF creep who's up for attempted rape now may for example have been set up by the chambermaid; he's a perfect target for blackmail etc. One doesn't have all the facts. But as Myers et al says, it's the reaction of atheists/skeptics etc that is very surprising and it is obvious that stupidity isn't limited to the faithful.
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