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Author Topic:

Time to take back South Africa...

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lennymaysay
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« on: March 19, 2010, 20:18:55 PM »

I'm sick to death of reading every single day of some new way in which the government and its cronies have cheated ordinary South Africans either through blatantly raiding the treasury or non-performance, or both. The level of disrespect and loathing for the citizens of this country is extremely disconcerting.

I'm aware that the vast majority of ordinary people are either oblivious to this grim state of affairs, apathetic or disinterested.

What can we do to highlight/expose/change things?

Failing all of the above, I think it's time for a revolution to take back the country and place it in the hands of (who can we trust?)
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sanlie
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« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2010, 13:13:25 PM »

I support your point..... however, what do you suggest should happen and how!
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StevoMuso
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2010, 17:51:20 PM »

I'm sick to death of reading every single day of some new way in which the government and its cronies have cheated ordinary South Africans either through blatantly raiding the treasury or non-performance, or both. The level of disrespect and loathing for the citizens of this country is extremely disconcerting.

Welcome to the forum Lennymaysay. I strongly disagree with your post. You have made a broad sweeping statement without evidence or verification. I think it is a bit much to say "every single day we read about ... government cheating ... disrespect and loathing for the citizens."

My view (for what it's worth) is that most of the people in our government are doing the best they can. Our government has some maturing to do, granted, but they are getting there even if you don't think so. Yes, there is corruption, but you will find that in any government. That's why we have a legal system (and I suppose you have something negative to say about that too).

And "revolution"? Are you serious? By whom? At least our government has been maturing over the last 16 years under very difficult circumstances, and you want a new one? And put us back 16 years again with an immature (and, if by revolution, we can assume militant) government. I think not.

On a personal level, may I add that, even though we are free to express ourselves freely in any way we wish, I personally don't feel it's appropriate to put evidence-lacking-unsupported government-trashing posts in this forum. But that's just me (sorry, I don't mean to speak for the rest of the members).
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Lilli
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Lelani Stolp
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2010, 07:46:01 AM »

(sorry, I don't mean to speak for the rest of the members).
I fully agree - negativity will certainly not help us move forward.
I'm sick to death of reading every single day ...I'm aware that the vast majority of ordinary people are either oblivious to this grim state of affairs, apathetic or disinterested.... Failing all of the above, I think it's time for a revolution to take back the country and place it in the hands of (who can we trust?)
You complain about negative things that happen in our country (which nobody can deny) and imply that the citizens of our country do not know/care. I'd like to know what you base this assuption on.
I would also like to know why on earth you think you have the right to complain about 'our government' as though every single person in our government should be labelled the same - what do you base this assumption on? I work with government and private organisations every day, and there are lazy, stupid, criminal and incompetent employees in both types of businesses.
I do not think you can simply point out problems if you are unwilling to be part of the solution, even if your attitude is the only positive contribution you are able to make.
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Faerie
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« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2010, 09:10:23 AM »

Good grief... revolution? We're in the middle of one, give it time, it'll sort itself out in due course.

Yes, we live in very negative times, but I do see plenty of little indications of positive things to come. We're in the process of uplifting 40 odd million illiterate rural people. Upliftment on this scale will take 2 - 3 generations, we're busy with the second one.  


I'm aware that the vast majority of ordinary people are either oblivious to this grim state of affairs, apathetic or disinterested.


and this is different how from the apartheid years? You, I and our parents simply turned our heads away from the unfortunates that suffered?

We are in a process of fixing things, support your local media - they have more power than you can imagine. Get involved in schooling - therein lies the salvation of all of us.

None of us are happy about the crime and other social issues, and if you really want to change things, take ONE child off the streets and give him an education.

But people screaming about revolutions generally dont want to dirty their hands with the really crappy jobs, do they?

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StevoMuso
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« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2010, 09:46:49 AM »

But people screaming about revolutions generally dont want to dirty their hands with the really crappy jobs, do they?

Brilliant. Faerie, that hits the nail on the head. And may I add that conspiracy theorists generally don't want to dirty their minds with honest truth.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2010, 12:31:14 PM »

I guess I'm pretty much a apathetic fatalist at this point. Corruption, crime, poverty, the problems of this world, have been problems for as long as man has existed and will continue to be for any future I can foresee. In the end we have too few resources and too many people. We can each do our "bit", I'm all for that. However the human race is just not sustainable, and that, to me, the the ultimate point it all boils down to. It's nice to have utopian ideas about how it should be, I have those as well... However I don't see it happening. The scarcity of resources means that the greedy win, every time, by whatever means necessary.

History tells me that we're not bound to enter a fair system of resource allocation and power any time soon.
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StevoMuso
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« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2010, 15:46:39 PM »

Er ... Lennymaysay, where have you gone? Please do not be put off by our challenges to your post. This is what we do here - we challenge each other and hopefully grow and learn as a result. Skepticism is not about being negative, it's about seeking verification to claims through evidence and debate.
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GCG
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skeptical mantis is skeptical


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« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2010, 16:06:35 PM »

unfortunately, if one screams revolution, you may end up getting one.  and, as history goes, they are rarely fluffy.  they are full of blood and guts.
so, a current example is mr malema himself.  he is inciting hate from both sides of the racial line.  this is not good.  allthough people are up in arms about the shit he's causing, he is, after all, just creating a distraction to whatever the government is busy with at present.
burn down the house while you rob the neighbours, as it were.

considering this county's history, we are not doing a too shitty job.  we could have been slaughtered the moment madiba set his feet on free soil.  it did not happen.

i doubt it will.  if one is smart enough to make it into government (which isnt very smart, but not too bad), surely you realise, and can learn from example (aka zim), that going the militant way, dont work.

whites are considered invader bastards, but shit, we kinda built the infrastructure and stuff.  and we know shit. 
i am not leaving this country.  thing might get worse, or better, or just remain as is, but no use crying revolution!

the previous government has treated the blacks like absolute shit, let them have their moment in the sun.  and yeah, crime is shitty, and the ecocnomy is shitty, and the roads are shitty, and and and.
i havent traveled much in my life, but what i hear from other people, is that the rest of the world isnt all roses either.
and we have got fuckin awesome weather to boot!! imagine shitty roads, shitty crime, shitty government, and to top if off, shitty weather!!!
no thank you very please.

i will do my job, as menial as it is, and be happy to see sunshine, and have friendly people in the supermarket.
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undertaker sun
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« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2010, 10:34:29 AM »

I THINK THAT WE SHOULD BRING BACK THE OLD SOUTH AFRICA, NOT IN THE SENSE OF BIENG RACIALIST BUT PUT SOME OF THESE "BUGGERS" DOWN tO sIZE AND ALSO I WOULD SUGGEST HAVE MORE THAN HALF OF THE METRO DEPT'S FIRED BECAUSE ALL WE HEAR OF ALL DAY LONG IS BLACK OFFICERS BEING CORRUPT EVERY DAY AND BRING LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TO SORT OUT THESE TAXIS THAT THINK THEY CAN JUST DRIVE AS THEY WISH THEY ARE NOT ABOVE THE LAW IN ANY WAY AND OTHER ROAD USES MAJORITY OF THE TAXI'S ARE NOT EVEN ROADWORTHY SIGNED DISGUSTED AND SICK AND TIERED ANOYED...
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Faerie
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« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2010, 10:56:20 AM »

^^^

Wow, all caps, all complaining and no proposed logical solution.

Another prime example of apartheid indoctrination.

Contrary to popular myth, life were'nt all that rosy during the apartheid years. Get a life.

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Faerie
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« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2010, 11:06:40 AM »

I THINK THAT WE SHOULD BRING BACK THE OLD SOUTH AFRICA, NOT IN THE SENSE OF BIENG RACIALIST BUT PUT SOME OF THESE "BUGGERS" DOWN tO sIZE
and what "size" would that be, smaller than yours? Sorta doubt its possible.

Quote
AND ALSO I WOULD SUGGEST HAVE MORE THAN HALF OF THE METRO DEPT'S FIRED BECAUSE ALL WE HEAR OF ALL DAY LONG IS BLACK OFFICERS BEING CORRUPT EVERY DAY
It was a black officer that picked me up half naked and took his shirt off to cover me when I was raped, it was his black colleagues that caught the bastard strolling down the road, and made sure he felt some of the hurt that I did when they took him into custody. It was a black officer that bought my son home when he was hijacked off his bicycle three years ago, holding a protective arm around the 11 year old sobbing boy. For every corrupt official there are 10 that simply do their job. Stop generalising.
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AND BRING LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TO SORT OUT THESE TAXIS THAT THINK THEY CAN JUST DRIVE AS THEY WISH THEY ARE NOT ABOVE THE LAW IN ANY WAY AND OTHER ROAD USES MAJORITY OF THE TAXI'S ARE NOT EVEN ROADWORTHY
And what exactly do you think they're trying to achieve with the BRT system? You think the government are spending this amount of money on transport just to piss the taxi industry off? They're trying to fix the problem. But then again, people with blinkers on dont generally look at the bigger picture.

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SIGNED DISGUSTED AND SICK AND TIERED ANOYED...
If you're really feel this way, why are'nt you out there doing something about the problems that face our society instead you post under a nic on an obscure forum that you have no interest in aside from attempting to make waves.

Its people like you that tires me out.
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StevoMuso
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« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2010, 12:20:07 PM »

It was a black officer that picked me up half naked and took his shirt off to cover me when I was raped, it was his black colleagues that caught the bastard strolling down the road, and made sure he felt some of the hurt that I did when they took him into custody. It was a black officer that bought my son home when he was hijacked off his bicycle three years ago, holding a protective arm around the 11 year old sobbing boy. For every corrupt official there are 10 that simply do their job. Stop generalising.
Black South Africans have developed incredibly over the past 16 years. Look around and you will see sophisticated, well-educated, well-spoken and well-behaved people growing constantly as a nation. It seems to me that it is now the WHITES who are still stuck in the past, full of anger and intolerance, perpetrating road rage instead of patience, and making ignorant posts like the one in CAPS above. And if you didn't SHOUT so much, UndertakerSun, maybe your spell-checker would work. GET WITH THE PROGRAM OR BUGGER OFF.
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BoogieMonster
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« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2010, 14:02:26 PM »

Wow, all caps, all complaining, no solutions, racist (I'm not being racist/"racialist" but....), no punctuation, no sentences, no paragraphs, and little coherency.

I think we can solve a good deal of your problems with a dictionary and grammar lessons.

Digressing....
That is a horrible story Faerie, I feel for you. Yes, we do have those that deserve a pat on the back. In the end, every nation/society has it's winners and losers.
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StevoMuso
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« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2010, 02:56:10 AM »

Brethren of the forum. I don't know about you guys but I'm getting some troll-warning bells again. These posts seem to be from the same type of person as our famous David Mabus - and could even be him too.

Here are the signs:
1. Only one post (2 at the most)
2. Very bad English
3. All emotion and no reasoning

Could be Mr Mabus trying to discredit our site with outlandishly violent anti-government propaganda. He can't get to us with lame anti-atheist posts, so he's trying another tactic.

Anyway - it's just my thoughts on these posts. Any ideas?
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